Ray “Boom Boom” Mancini: Rust Belt Champions, A New Golden Era, The Tale of Black Monday, Mexican Style, Dustin Hoffman, The Haymonites, Hotel California, & The Footprints of Gracie… Part I
Exclusive Interview by Joshua “City” Brewer
“You know, I fought representing my city (Youngstown), I’ve always said that and they kind of lived vicariously through me. It was a beautiful relationship, really a kind of once in a lifetime relationship.” –Ray “Boom Boom” Mancini
When one reflects on the guts and glory of the Sweet Science, the history of the sort of boxing is filled with many stories. Some span multiple generations as is the case of Raymond “Boom Boom” Mancini, 29-5, 23 KO’s. In this two-part interview we’ll take a look back at the roots of Ray Mancini’s foundation, starting with his father, Lenny “Boom Boom” Mancini, 46-12-3, 16 KO’s who also fought under what is one of the most recognizable nicknames across all sports.
We also get into the depths of the rich boxing history of Youngstown, Ohio. While all are created equal, the size of a man’s heart can only be measured by his actions. Not every story makes it to the big screen, but this story was preconceived long before the gloves were laced.
JB: You’re from Youngstown, Ohio. Your father was a boxer and veteran of WWII. What was the boxing scene in Youngstown during your younger days and how might that compare to now?
Youngstown has always been a strong boxing city. Not only Youngstown, but all of north eastern Ohio, Akron, Canton, Cleveland, Youngstown, and western PA, Farrell, Pennsylvania. Where we are located geographically, we’re 60 miles northwest of Pittsburgh, and 60 miles southeast of Cleveland, so we’re centrally located, literally right in the middle. For years, whether it was boxing, event entertainment, singers, rock and roll bands that were going to Cleveland, or Pittsburgh, or any other town, they would stop in Youngstown. Youngstown was always a major stop-over. Even back in the day, 1940s, 1950s, and 1960s, fighters in northeast Ohio, it’s a strong boxing community between Cleveland and Pittsburgh. So, there are a lot of major fights in the area.
Youngstown always had a very strong contingency of fighters. In the 1930s and 1940s, from my father to Jack Trammell. Jack Trammell was the #3 heavyweight when Joe Louis was champion. Tommy Bell. Tommy Bell fought Sugar Ray Robinson for the welterweight title. To Tony Janiro, Joe “Red” D’Amato, there are so many. But, we’ve always had a strong amateur program. In the 1960s and 1970s, as a matter of fact, it’s funny because for a long time boxers weren’t even turning pro. We had so many good amateurs that we’d sell-out. The Golden Gloves would sell-out every week, 3000 to 3500 people. The amateurs were very strong. I turned pro in October, 1979, I wasn’t going to wait for the Olympics. There were four of us at the same time who were amateurs that fought on the national team, representing Youngstown, OH.
In Youngstown, you had to win the Golden Gloves there, then you’d go to the regionals in Cleveland. From there, you went to the nationals, representing the Lake Erie team. Four of us who ended up winning titles were on that team. Harry Arroyo, Jeff Lampkin, Greg Richardson and I. The funny thing is Jeff Lampkin and I started our amateur careers in the same year, but Harry and Greg started earlier. For whatever reason, they stuck around the amateurs for what I thought was a little longer than they should have.
They both were terrific fighters and both ended up winning world titles but I tell people, as a fighter, your body only has so many fights in you, amateur or pro. I thought these guys used some of their best years in the amateurs and probably should have turned pro earlier, and they still ended up winning world titles. That’s just me. But to get into your question, we’ve always had strong representation in the amateur and pros in northeastern Ohio, especially Youngstown. As I said, I mentioned the guys earlier that were fighters.
When I turned pro 1979, I was one of the first fighters in a long time to have turned pro and the people supported me, they came out. I make no bones about it, I came at the right time. We were only two years removed from the steel-mill shutting down. The town needed something to hold onto. September 19th, 1977, known as ‘Black Monday’ to this day. The steel-mill shut down. In those two years we struggled, financially, and that was a little harsh. Sports in Youngstown, whether that’s boxing or football, it’s always been a thread through the community, kind of the lifeblood. So, when I turned pro, people came out in droves to support me because they needed something to hold on to and I was that guy.
You know, I fought representing my city, I’ve always said that and they kind of lived vicariously through me. It was a beautiful relationship, really a kind of once in a lifetime relationship. The people supported me wherever I went. When I fought in Atlantic City, out west in Las Vegas, or Reno, the people supported me. Part of it was the relationship that we had and they always supported me. It was a beautiful thing, plus my style of fighting was emblematic of the city. Come forward and take shots to give shots. Bottom line, I’m coming and keep coming, and hopefully at the end of the day I’m still standing, kind of like the city of Youngstown.
JB: Yes, you were definitely a fan friendly fighter. You never ducked or dodged anyone!
I appreciate that. Yes, thank you. That’s one of the reasons why my relationship with the city of Youngstown is different than others, because my style is more emblematic of the city.
JB: I feel like since late 2016, up until now, at least with the lineups we’ve seen so far in 2018, we’re starting to see more of the best fighting the best. I think that’s going to carryover and ultimately bring the sport back to a high level like it once was from a popularity standpoint, to include more on network television. What are your thoughts on boxing now and do you think it’s poised to hit another one of those Golden Era’s where 50 years from now we’re going to be talking about this crop of fighters?
I hope so, I definitely hope so. Look, in boxing there has always been great fighters. The problem is people will ask me, ‘what does boxing need to do to get back to where it once was’ and I tell them, without network television being involved it will never have the same popularity, never.
When I fought on network television, I was exposed to over 60 million people domestically and over 100 million people worldwide. Now, with Pay-Per-View, they get a 2% buy rate which they consider a success. There’s only about 30 million homes that are capable of Pay-Per-View. At a 2% buy rate that’s only a half a million people to 600,000. Look, I’m a fight fan and I can’t tell you half of the fighters if they were to walk down the street. There’s no visibility factor for the fans. If you don’t purchase Pay-Per-View, you have no shot at telling who the fighters are.
As mentioned, I’m a fight fan and can’t tell you who half the fighters are! When Al Haymon came with the Premier Boxing Champions (PBC), I thought that it was a great concept, getting back on network television. The problem is that he bought every channel out. You can’t have a monopoly in boxing because you can’t have the top matchups that you should have. Now, obviously he’s fading, he still has some, but he faded. A lot of networks weren’t getting premier fights, by no means. They were getting a lot of lackluster fights.
People get turned off by that. There are no ratings for it. I think now, what you’re seeing this year, if the fights happen that they’re saying are going to happen it’s going to be a banner year. Like you said, they’ll have the best fighting the best.
Look, Gennady “GGG” Golovkin called out Saul “Canelo” Alvarez for a year and a half. Canelo finally rose to the occasion. He didn’t rise because he all of a sudden grew a set of balls, he got jaded because the Mexican people were backing him up and saying ‘Hey, fight him!’ He’s calling you out and you’re avoiding him. He called him out for a year and a half and Oscar De La Hoya thinks he’s some kind of genius, he’s not. Let me tell you something, the Mexican people, most of them, went over to “GGG”. First, he has their style. It’s the style they like and that’s why he referred to himself as ‘Mexican Style’. He called him out for a year and a half and finally Canelo stepped up because as I said, the pressure was getting to him and finally they had to make the match.
De La Hoya came out saying the timing was right, bullshit! You got backed into a corner. Now, they fought and I think the general consensus was that “GGG” won the fight. I think it was pretty obvious he won the fight but they called it a draw by the grace of Adalaide Byrd. She should never judge another title fight in her life. And for whatever reason these other judges, Don Trella being one of them, who had it a draw, yet the one round that was pretty definitive he gave to Canelo!
I don’t get that, it makes no sense. I’ve done commentary where I’ve judged rounds and come on, man. It’s pretty conclusive that the seventh round was won by “GGG”. He called it a draw! He gave it to Canelo and if he gives it to “GGG” like everyone else did, which was pretty obvious, “GGG” wins the fight.
What I loved about “GGG” is for years everyone was saying he hadn’t fought anybody. Well, he was calling out everybody. He called everyone out from Floyd Mayweather, JR. to Andre Ward. Ward eventually moved up but “GGG” was calling out everyone and nobody stepped up. So, you have to fight the guys that were there. What he did do, and this is what I love about Tom Loeffler and “GGG” as a team, they started collecting belts, all these belts that supposedly meant nothing.
So then, when they called the real guys out, people were going ‘oh I don’t want this I’ll fight for the WBA’. Well, “GGG” had that and they would say, ‘well I’m going to fight for the IBF’. Well, “GGG” has that too. All this time he’s been collecting belts and he would call a guy out and they’d say they’re going to fight for another belt. He had that already. I love the fact that they cornered them. Half the guys you have to admire the fact that they even took the fight. Guys like Dominic Wade or this or that fighter. But these type of guys would have done well against Canelo I think, or against Billy Joe Saunders. It’s that “GGG’s” power is so strong along with his boxing ability and knowledge.
Here’s the thing that people don’t talk about regarding “GGG’s” fight with Canelo. I personally think that Canelo cared about how “GGG’s” a gym rat. He’s always up in the gym. Even when he doesn’t have a fight he’s up in Big Bear training, right. Well, that’s not good. You need a break from the gym or you get stale. To me, “GGG” looked stale. It looked as though he overtrained for the fight because in the middle rounds his body got stale. I could tell being a fighter because when he needed to turn on the juice he didn’t have it.
Being overtrained and undertrained are a lot of the same symptoms. Here’s the difference. When you’re undertrained you’ve got no gas in the tank. When you overtrain you have the gas, but you can’t change speeds. If you notice that, in the later rounds he couldn’t change speeds. His punches were starting to drag a little bit. When he’s on point and sharp, he punches through guys. His punches started to drag a little bit and I’m not saying he would have knocked Canelo out, Canelo is a terrific fighter and champion. What I’m saying is that when “GGG” needed to turn on the juice he didn’t have it.
Recently, I heard him make a comment or something, not that he admitted this, but he was that his body wouldn’t react. That when he tried, his body wouldn’t react which is what I was saying in that he overtrained. Like I said, he’s always up at Big Bear and sometimes your body needs the rest. Your mind needs to get away from it. Abel Sanchez knows that and Abel Sanchez is a terrific trainer. I don’t know why he didn’t make him stay out of the gym for a while.
But now they’ve said that he’s not going to be up there all of the time. Now they are going to work in time to be away from the gym, away from Big Bear until the fight. I think they both realized that he overtrained. I think if he wouldn’t have been overtrained then it’d be pretty obvious that he would have won the fight much wider than he actually did.
JB: Mikey Garcia Vs Sergey Lipinets? (Editor’s Note: Comments were made prior to the actual fight)
Tough guy (Lipinets). Mikey Garcia is another one of those guys that is in another category right now, he’s at the top of his game. They were talking about Mikey Garcia fighting for example Jorge Linares but wouldn’t because of Golden Boy. The guy who actually handles Linares is a Japanese promoter and he said it’d be okay. It was Golden Boy that screwed up and said that they couldn’t do it in the time frame. Let me tell you something, you can make anything work, anytime.
JB: Shifting back to you, in 2015 you were inducted into the International Boxing Hall of Fame (IBHOF). I’ve been up there and it’s a sight to see. I think that every boxing fan should visit this place if they get the opportunity. What was that moment like when you got inducted? Deservingly!
When I got the call that I was even on the ballot I was so honored, believe me. There’s no false modesty, I didn’t think my career warranted it, only because I didn’t fight long enough. My whole career was five and a half years. When you think of the hall of fame you think of longevity, guys who fought for 10, 12, and 15 years. So, when I was on the ballot I felt as though I was a winner simply because of that. Then, when I got the call that I was actually voted in, I was floating. I was on cloud nine. I was so honored to be inducted with my hero’s, friends of mine, guys that I looked up to throughout my career.
I’m in the same hall with the great fighters that my father use to tell me about. The great Rocky Graziano, Tony Canzoneri and Joe Louis. Henry Armstrong and Carmen Basilio and Rocky Marciano and Roberto Duran. My hero’s and I’m right there with them. It blew me away. When the reporter called me, I told him what I just told you, I’m really honored and overwhelmed because I didn’t think my career warranted it because I didn’t fight long enough. What the guy told me is this, he said it wasn’t the quantity of your fights, it was the quality of your fights. I said, I’ll take it then. That meant the world to me. I’m honored. Truly, truly honored.
JB: You definitely deserve to be amongst the legends in being one yourself. You can’t tell the story of boxing without the mention of Ray “Boom Boom” Mancini.
Thank you. That’s very kind of you. It means the world to me.
No, I have to be honest with you. I started being represented by William Morris Agency in 1983. I was still fighting and I was being offered opportunities in entertainment. I was being represented for commercial endorsement, appearances, commentary and things like that. Then I started being offered these acting roles for cameos and shows. I never thought of acting but I was never able to take advantage of it because I was in the middle of my career. I was training. Once I retired, after the second Bramble fight, and I had no love for the game, I told my agent I want to give the entertainment thing a shot.
I was being offered a couple of things at the time while I was in training camp and I said I want to get into entertainment and I want to do it the right way, what do I do? So, he said that I had to move out there, I had to come to California. Thing is, when I turned pro, as a fighter, I went to New York. You know the old saying, if you want to go fishing you have to go to the water. So, I went to California and I wound up being there for 30 years until I moved back 3 years ago.
I enjoy it, this was the profession I chose. It’s not an easy profession. I feel like I’ve gone from the firing pin into the fire. People always say to me, what’s easier, boxing or entertainment, the movie business? Put it this way, in the ring if I win, I win. If I lose, I lose, and I know it. In the boxing business I control my own destiny. In this entertainment business, I control very little. As a producer, I only became a producer because I had to have some type of control over my destiny.
I wasn’t getting offered any big roles. I wasn’t being offered the types of things I wanted to do. And I said why can’t I do my own? The original sentiment was that I should just worry about auditioning and getting big. Well, when you audition, the casting director has to decide for you. The director has to decide. You don’t get to the second level sometimes because of certain people. They don’t see what’s in you. You can come in and think you did a good job and then other people decide your fate is my point. At least in the ring I control my own fate. I thought that at least if I can start my own production company, I can have some type of control. Even then people are like you should worry about acting, don’t worry about that.
Look, I didn’t know anything about producing and I learned through trial and error. At least now I’ve produced for MGM, I’ve produced for Warner, my last movie Warner Brothers picked up. I’ve done a couple of documentaries, I’ve gotten actual releases. Now I come into a studio I know the dialogue, I know the talk. I can sit with anybody and talk the business. Here’s the thing, the entertainment business changes rapidly. You have to be in tune with what’s going on. When you’re having conversations with producers you have to know the dialogue. You have to know what’s happening now because what they tell you today may not be the case next week.
That’s how I got into it. But one thing I will say, I always tell people this is my favorite story. Dustin Hoffman, I met him years ago and he had a great line. He said “What are you doing? I heard you’re trying to produce. In the fight game if you get knocked on your ass you know it. In this business, you can get knocked on your ass for months and never know it.” It’s true. People don’t know and don’t realize that nobody’s interested. You can be knocked on your ass for months or years and not even know it. Here’s the main thing, at least the camera doesn’t punch back. The worst thing that happens is take two. I’ll take it
JB: You’re a Purple belt in Brazilian Jiu Jitsu (BJJ). I’ve dabbled in BJJ a little bit myself, but nothing beyond white belt. I know it takes a good deal of time to get to the purple belt level, years, and it’s not an easy thing to master. How long have you been doing BJJ?
I trained in jiu jitsu for about 11 years. I only did it for two reasons. One I wanted a different type of workout so to speak. And two, everybody knows something. The Gracie’s started jiu jitsu out in southern California. Everybody knows something now. You’ve got a lot of angry people, a lot of angry kids out there now. I don’t know why. You’ve got the sun, you’ve got the water, I don’t know what there is to be angry about. My whole thing is I don’t want an 18 year old kid choking me out in the street. I said, I know how to fight on my feet, so now I want to learn to fight on my back, that’s the thing.
I started training with Renato Magno in Santa Monica. He was part of the Machado family, who are first cousins. They’re all Gracie jiu jitsu, these guys trained for years. Renato is one of the greatest trainers out there. He’s trained Dave Mamet. Dave Mamet just got his black belt recently. He’s also trained Clark Gregg. He’s trained a lot of people in the entertainment business and a lot of guys in the street.
He’s really one of the great trainers out there. I’ve been fortunate enough to work with him. I just wanted to learn it for the street. I didn’t want to compete or anything. It’s well appreciated, they had a lot of respect for me when I went in there. You leave your ego at the door when you go in there. I’m a novice when I go in there, so to speak. I climbed the ladder.
Stay tuned for Part II of our exclusive RSR interview with Ray “Boom Boom” Mancini where we’ll discuss Canelo Vs Golovkin 2, Joshua Vs Wilder, Swift, the UFC, and Monkey’s Nest.
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